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    WHERE IS JAY

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    Son of Ron
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    WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:32 pm

    HIS MARINERS ARE BEING GIVEN AWAY!!!!!!


    6er of Summer Shandy says the Mariners make the playoffs b4 OUR White Sox.


    Maybe then people will understand that rebuilding is not an excuse for sucking.  Side effect YES!  Excuse, NEVER.  There is a difference.


    PS, what BS stat are people looking at that would lead them to believe OUR White Sox gave up too much for Colome?!?!?
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    Jack Brickhouse
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Jack Brickhouse on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:24 am

    Chicago history says the Sox have to suck.
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:24 am

    Jack Brickhouse wrote:Chicago history says the Sox have to suck.


    100TH ANNIVERSARY OF THE BLACK SOX!!!!!!!


    BRYCE HARPER WILL BECOME ADAM DUNN IF THE WHITE SOX SIGN HIM


    MEANWHILE, MR BAD MATH IS TELLING US THAT IF MONCADA CAN REDUCE HIS STRIKE OUTS AND INCREASE HIS BATTING AVERAGE, THEN HE'LL BE A GOOD PLAYER


    THANK YOU CAPTAIN FREAKIN' OBVIOUS


    BTW, JUST HOW DOES MONCADA DO THAT?!?!?!?  EXIT VELOCITY???  LAUNCH ANGLE???  OR THE MULTICOLINEARITY OF 1.8?!?!?!?
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    jaywit
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by jaywit on Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:16 am

    Son of Ron wrote:HIS MARINERS ARE BEING GIVEN AWAY!!!!!!


    6er of Summer Shandy says the Mariners make the playoffs b4 OUR White Sox.


    Maybe then people will understand that rebuilding is not an excuse for sucking.  Side effect YES!  Excuse, NEVER.  There is a difference.


    PS, what BS stat are people looking at that would lead them to believe OUR White Sox gave up too much for Colome?!?!?
    The team that won 89 games in 2018 has rightly been blown up.  GM Dipoto is betting that his aging team has gotten as close to the Astros and the Red Sox as they were going to get.  With Cano and Boomstick a year older (and Cano a year weaker from drug withdrawal) and The Big Maple continuing the streak of shortened seasons due to injury, I think Dipoto's making the right choice.  Reshuffle the deck and hope for better 3-6 years from now.  Now I'm waiting to see who they get for Haniger.  After him, the rest of the squad won't net any decent prospects.


    I wish they'd have hung on to Diaz until the trade deadline mid-2019 season.  They would have likely picked up better prospects to a pennant contender that needs a new ace in the bullpen.
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    jaywit
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by jaywit on Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:21 am

    You put Haniger in little Comiskey and he gets 30+ HRs with an .850 OPS.  Sox got anything the M's would be interested in?
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:57 am

    jaywit wrote:
    Son of Ron wrote:HIS MARINERS ARE BEING GIVEN AWAY!!!!!!


    6er of Summer Shandy says the Mariners make the playoffs b4 OUR White Sox.


    Maybe then people will understand that rebuilding is not an excuse for sucking.  Side effect YES!  Excuse, NEVER.  There is a difference.


    PS, what BS stat are people looking at that would lead them to believe OUR White Sox gave up too much for Colome?!?!?
    The team that won 89 games in 2018 has rightly been blown up.  GM Dipoto is betting that his aging team has gotten as close to the Astros and the Red Sox as they were going to get.  With Cano and Boomstick a year older (and Cano a year weaker from drug withdrawal) and The Big Maple continuing the streak of shortened seasons due to injury, I think Dipoto's making the right choice.  Reshuffle the deck and hope for better 3-6 years from now.  Now I'm waiting to see who they get for Haniger.  After him, the rest of the squad won't net any decent prospects.


    I wish they'd have hung on to Diaz until the trade deadline mid-2019 season.  They would have likely picked up better prospects to a pennant contender that needs a new ace in the bullpen.

    So in other words, the Mariners are doing what OUR White Sox should have done after the 2010 season when they won 88 games with a bunch of guys having obvious last hurrah years.


    And who was it that claimed no self respecting GM would have blown up the 2010 White Sox?!?!?  I'll give you 1.8 guesses


    Glad to see at least one team learning from the White Sox mistakes.  And they aren't even getting 5 extra drafts picks in the first two rounds
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:00 am

    jaywit wrote:You put Haniger in little Comiskey and he gets 30+ HRs with an .850 OPS.  Sox got anything the M's would be interested in?


    JUST WHAT OUR WHITE SOX NEED


    ANOTHER RIGHTHANDED DH TYPE


    SORRY JAY, DON'T SEE HOW HE FITS
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    rmapasad
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by rmapasad on Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:52 pm

    Son of Ron wrote:

    So in other words, the Mariners are doing what OUR White Sox should have done after the 2010 season when they won 88 games with a bunch of guys having obvious last hurrah years.
    And who was it that claimed no self respecting GM would have blown up the 2010 White Sox?!?!?  I'll give you 1.8 guesses
    Glad to see at least one team learning from the White Sox mistakes.  And they aren't even getting 5 extra drafts picks in the first two rounds

    Yeah, the 2018 M's were really looking at the "lesson" of the 2010 White Sox. Please.  What 2010 Sox members had "obvious" last hurrah years aside from Vizquel and Manny Ramirez, who were washed-up and didn't play that much anyway ? Yeah, Konerko was 34 and coming off his best year ever but he was still a good hitter for the next two seasons.  AJ was 33 but his next 3 seasons were all better than his 2010.  
    The 2010 roster had enough material for the Sox in 2012 to be a first place team nearly every day from late May until the very last week of September. Konerko and AJ hit well, Rios and Peavy were strong, De Aza proved useful and Sale emerged as best starter in the AL. Had the Sox held onto Buehrle in '12 they likely would have won the Central. So it wasn't that obvious they needed to blow things up after 2010.

    It WAS obvious they needed to blow things up after 2012 when Peavy, Rios were coming off career-type years, Konerko had his true last hurrah at age 36 and the Sox still fell short.  It was also clear by then that Beckham, Viciedo, Morel weren't going to be good players, Danks and Floyd weren't the same after arm problems, and that Dunn was over the hill. The only real foundation to build off of were Sale and Quintana.
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:32 pm

    I called it at the time and history proved me correct

    I also love how 33 and 34 are now young to you.  Whatever happened to losing 85% of your value after age 32.  Or is that more of your invented math.

    Plus you conveniently left out the 5 extra draft picks by letting Konerko and AJ and Putz walk.  Instant farm system jump start.  Pissed away on Adam Dunn.  

    Once again, I called it.  But you’d rather lie about what happen like RobZ lies about $2 gas. Like how you now claim the should have keep Buehrle when you spent the last 7 years claiming Danks was a more logical pick.  Why to prove yourself a liar and a hypocrite
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:36 pm

    Gotta love Rogers dumb ass logic

    The time to blow it up is right after it falls apart

    Well Duh

    I guess Capt Obvious never heard of being proactive.  Just like he never heard of multicolinearity.
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    jaywit
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by jaywit on Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:42 am

    Son of Ron wrote:
    jaywit wrote:You put Haniger in little Comiskey and he gets 30+ HRs with an .850 OPS.  Sox got anything the M's would be interested in?


    JUST WHAT OUR WHITE SOX NEED


    ANOTHER RIGHTHANDED DH TYPE


    SORRY JAY, DON'T SEE HOW HE FITS
    Actually, he's a legitimate right fielder with decent range and a good arm.  He'll likely be peaking the next 1-4 years, a little soon for Mariner plans.  He'll do well anywhere but he'll really flourish if he can get into a hitters park.  Hope Fenway calls for this right hander.
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    rmapasad
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by rmapasad on Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:53 am

    Son of Ron wrote:I called it at the time and history proved me correct

    I also love how 33 and 34 are now young to you.  Whatever happened to losing 85% of your value after age 32.  Or is that more of your invented math.

    Plus you conveniently left out the 5 extra draft picks by letting Konerko and AJ and Putz walk.  Instant farm system jump start.  Pissed away on Adam Dunn.  

    Once again, I called it.  But you’d rather lie about what happen like RobZ lies about $2 gas. Like how you now claim the should have keep Buehrle when you spent the last 7 years claiming Danks was a more logical pick.  Why to prove yourself a liar and a hypocrite

    I will simply deal with facts instead of your typical off-base insults.  FACTS:

    1- Sox had best pitching WAR in the majors in 2010 and the core staff wasn't old - Danks 25, Floyd 27, Jackson 26, Peavy 29, Buehrle 31.  They had also just brought up a promising 21 year old Chris Sale. Pitching was a solid foundation and Sox re-proved that with 2nd best pitching WAR in majors in 2011. 

    2- While hitters slide in their mid-30's, Konerko's 970 OPS in 2010 left him plenty of room to slide but still be good. Which he was (906 in 2011 and 857 in 2012).


    3 - Sox were in first place at trade deadline in 2010 and still in contention on Labor Day.  Most GM's don't blow such teams up especially when the pitching is solid as the Sox's.  Sox were still in the hunt for Central in late July 2011, despite the Dunn disaster, Rios' bad year and Peavy being hurt.  When those guys rebounded in 2012, Sox led the Central for vast majority of season which showed the team had enough material to contend after 2010.


    4 - Reason Sox couldn't get over the hump in 2012 was Reindorf's typical cheapness and Kenny's missteps.  Going into 2012, they had big problems not only with Dunn, but 2b, 3b, LF. Sox stuck with Beckham at 2b despite two straight years of declining performance, they used bust Morel and a washed up Hudson for 3b, and somehow thought Viciedo merited the starting LF job despite a mid 600's OPS in 2011.  Plus Kenny trades Quentin, who despite injuries could still hit and a useful reliever in Santos for ZILCH.  


    5- Sox could have kept Buehrle and waited one more year on a Danks extension after 2011 season but Reinsdorf felt the budget meant they could only keep one. While at the time Danks was 6 years younger and looked like the better bet for a longer term contract, the fact they felt to make a choice was due to money.   


    6- Instead of paying for a more experienced Manager in 2012, Sox went with Ventura.


    7 - Sounds good in theory that Sox would have gotten 5 of the first 60 draft picks in 2011 from letting Konerko, AJ and Putz walk and not signing Dunn. Reality is that these picks would not have transformed the franchise because of weak depth of 2011 draft crop.   For Konerko, Sox would have gotten 19th and 36th picks, kept their 23rd pick by not signing Dunn, got the 47th pick for letting Putz walk and probably the 52-53rd pick for letting AJ go free agent. 
    As with most drafts, the real cream of the crop was in top 15 picks and that was very true in 2011. After the 18th pick, only 7 of the next 42 picks amounted to anything ( 1 in 6).  With 5 picks Sox's odds were to get one useful player.   Best position player of that bunch has been Jackie Bradley who went 40th.  Sox would have had three shots at him (19th, 23rd, and 36th) and let's say they got him.  But Bradley that big a difference maker ?  He's a good defensive CFer but also a career .238 hitter (724 OPS).   Sox pissed away the 47th pick on Keenyn Walker and given the slim pickings after that would likely have gotten zilch for the AJ comp pick.  
    To expect this front office crew in 2011 to have cherry-picked much value from the 19-60 picks was expecting a major miracle.  











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    rmapasad
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by rmapasad on Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:15 pm

    Son of Ron wrote:Gotta love Rogers dumb ass logic

    The time to blow it up is right after it falls apart

    Well Duh

    I guess Capt Obvious never heard of being proactive.  Just like he never heard of multicolinearity.


    As usual, you have your own version of reality rather than see reality itself.  Reality is that the Mariners are one of very few teams who decide to blow up their roster after a near 90 win season. Mariners were confronted with some very stark realities - a juggernaut competitor in the Astros in AL West along with a resurgent A's team plus their typical core of Cano, King Felix and Cruz (who's 37 and turning free agent) can't be counted on any longer.  They had Segura, Haniger and Paxton as their main prime age players which aren;t enough to challenge the Astros unless the M's plunged big into free agent spending.
    No team likes to rebuild as that means sucking for at least next 2-3 seasons (another reality you continually deny).  So most teams will try to supplement a high 80 win team with the extra pieces they think will get them over the hump unless (like the M's) they are confronted with huge odds and a few extra pieces clearly won't be enough. And yeah, a lot of such teams fail to get over the hump and wait to rebuild until they  crash and burn as the 2016 Sox did. Or as the 2017 Tigers, Orioles and Rangers did.  It's a long list.
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    rmapasad
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by rmapasad on Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:36 pm

    jaywit wrote:
    Son of Ron wrote:
    jaywit wrote:You put Haniger in little Comiskey and he gets 30+ HRs with an .850 OPS.  Sox got anything the M's would be interested in?


    JUST WHAT OUR WHITE SOX NEED


    ANOTHER RIGHTHANDED DH TYPE


    SORRY JAY, DON'T SEE HOW HE FITS
    Actually, he's a legitimate right fielder with decent range and a good arm.  He'll likely be peaking the next 1-4 years, a little soon for Mariner plans.  He'll do well anywhere but he'll really flourish if he can get into a hitters park.  Hope Fenway calls for this right hander.

    Haniger is a late bloomer. He was pretty mediocre as a 23-24 year old in AA with the Brewers and D-Backs.  Hit well in AA and AAA as a 25 year old, but when the D-Backs called him up that year, he posted just a 713 OPS.   But he definitely came into his own as a 26-27 year old with the Mariners.  Baseball Reference and Fan Graphs see his last season as a peak as they both predict fairly decent declines for him in 2019.  While the M's see him as a keeper, there's also an argument that they may be well-advised to deal him now when his value is high provided they get a good haul. 
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    jaywit
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by jaywit on Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:48 pm

    rmapasad wrote:
    jaywit wrote:
    Son of Ron wrote:
    jaywit wrote:You put Haniger in little Comiskey and he gets 30+ HRs with an .850 OPS.  Sox got anything the M's would be interested in?


    JUST WHAT OUR WHITE SOX NEED


    ANOTHER RIGHTHANDED DH TYPE


    SORRY JAY, DON'T SEE HOW HE FITS
    Actually, he's a legitimate right fielder with decent range and a good arm.  He'll likely be peaking the next 1-4 years, a little soon for Mariner plans.  He'll do well anywhere but he'll really flourish if he can get into a hitters park.  Hope Fenway calls for this right hander.

    Haniger is a late bloomer. He was pretty mediocre as a 23-24 year old in AA with the Brewers and D-Backs.  Hit well in AA and AAA as a 25 year old, but when the D-Backs called him up that year, he posted just a 713 OPS.   But he definitely came into his own as a 26-27 year old with the Mariners.  Baseball Reference and Fan Graphs see his last season as a peak as they both predict fairly decent declines for him in 2019.  While the M's see him as a keeper, there's also an argument that they may be well-advised to deal him now when his value is high provided they get a good haul. 
    I'm hoping the M's don't see him as a keeper and trade him now.  He'll have a few good seasons and should net a good prospect or two.
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    rmapasad
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by rmapasad on Sat Dec 08, 2018 2:08 pm

    jaywit wrote:
    I'm hoping the M's don't see him as a keeper and trade him now.  He'll have a few good seasons and should net a good prospect or two.


    Agree, Haniger could be a Josh Reddick type OFer who's been a solid high 700's-low-mid 800's guy through age 30 but  fizzled out at age 31 last year. As such, he makes sense for a team that will contend over next 2-3 years but not so much if the M's see themselves as 3-5 years away. 
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:29 pm

    LMAO.


    FACT FROM MR LONG WINDED BULLCRAP


    HERE ARE THE FACTS A SANE PERSON SEES:


    FACT:  2010 WHITE SOX LOST


    FACT: 2011 WHITE SOX LOST EVEN MORE DESPITE A HUGE SPENDING SPREE


    FACT: 2012 WHITE SOX LOST AND WAS THE LAST 500+ SEASON FOR THE TEAM.


    FACT: THE KARK ADVOCATED BLOWING IT UP AT THE TIME.  UNLIKE YOU WHO IS CLEARLY MONDAY MORNING QB'ing.
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:35 pm

    YOU ARE SO FULL OF SHIT


    IT IS YOU THAT INVENTS HIS OWN MATH THEN LIES ABOUT MULTICOLINEARITY BY INVENTING IMAGINARY CONVERSATIONS WITH SABERMETICIANS HE HAS NEVER MET.


    OR IS THAT YOU PRETENDING TO BE YOUR HERO IN ANOTHER THREAD.


    REGARDLESS, THE MAN AND HIS LINKS PROVED EVERYTHING I SAID ABOUT THE SUBJECT 100% AND ALSO SHOWS WHAT A LYING SACK OF CRAP YOU ARE.


    AND THAT IS WHY I INSULT YOU.  JUST LIKE ROBZ, YOU EARNED IT BY OUT RIGHT LYING TO ME ON A CONSTANT BASIS


    YOU WANT TO SEE REALITY.  2011 WHITE SOX SUCKED.  2018 MARINERS ARE GETTING BLOWN UP.  YOU ACTING LIKE A FREAKIN' KNOW IT ALL AND BORING THE BOARD WITH USELESS TERM PAPERS
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    Son of Ron
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    Re: WHERE IS JAY

    Post by Son of Ron on Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:47 pm

    1- Sox had best pitching WAR in the majors in 2010 and the core staff wasn't old - Danks 25, Floyd 27, Jackson 26, Peavy 29, Buehrle 31.  They had also just brought up a promising 21 year old Chris Sale. Pitching was a solid foundation and Sox re-proved that with 2nd best pitching WAR in majors in 2011. 


    ********************************


    HOW IN THE BLUE HELL WAS THIS POSSIBLE WITH A TEAM ERA OF 4.09, A PUSSY HAIR BETTER THAN THE LEAGUE AVERAGE.  4 OF YOUR TOP 5 STARTERS WITH AN ERA OVER 4.


    2ND BEST PITCHING IN THE LEAGUE MY BLACK ASS


    PLUS IN 2010, PEOPLE THOUGHT SALE'S ARM WOULD FALL OFF DUE TO HIS FUNKY MECHANICS.


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