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    USA Today 2016 Predictions

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    MGJOHNSON
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    USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Mon Mar 07, 2016 11:05 am

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2016/02/15/mlb-2016-win-totals/80389576/


    Perhaps a Cross-town World Series IF the Cubs can make it that far...

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:21 pm

    BURN CHICAGO BURN

    A SOX - CUB CIVIL WAR FOLLOW BY THE TRUMP - HILLARY CIVIL WAR

    CAN'T WAIT FOR THANKSGIVING DINNER!!!!!


    OH YEAH, MY TEAM AND PRESIDENT MAY BE A LOSER, BUT I'M NOT THE LOSER THAT DRANK AWAY HIS 20'S.  AND THEN YOU WONDER WHY MOM HATED YOU
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:47 pm

    Perhaps a Cross-town World Series IF the Cubs can make it that far...>>
    BELIEVE !  I think the article sums it up best.  There's a case for all five AL Central teams to finish first (or last) depending on what happens to this guy or that guy. Obviously Sox have three top notch LHers in the rotation and the offense has plugged up some of the worst holes from last year.  Fair to say these improvements could make the Sox at least an 83-84 win team, and if a few guys like Latos, Cabrera, Jackson, Lawry really step it up, then 90 wins isn't outlandish.   But an injury here or there could mean that 78 wins isn't outlandish either.  This is not a particularly deep team.
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Shooters Buffet on Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:50 pm

    BELIEVE!!
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Mar 07, 2016 10:31 pm

    They still have Robin Ventura as manager. 5th place.

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Tue Mar 08, 2016 11:12 am

    Cream1953 wrote:They still have Robin Ventura as manager. 5th place.

    Newly acquired Austin Jackson has a lifetime .278 batting average against right-handed pitching compared with a .261 average against southpaws.  According to the Sox website, Ventura says that he plans to play Jackson mostly against left-handed pitching. scratch

    It appears that Robin is in mid-season form. Sad
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Tue Mar 08, 2016 11:57 am

    MGJOHNSON wrote:
    Cream1953 wrote:They still have Robin Ventura as manager. 5th place.

    Newly acquired Austin Jackson has a lifetime .278 batting average against right-handed pitching compared with a .261 average against southpaws.  According to the Sox website, Ventura says that he plans to play Jackson mostly against left-handed pitching. scratch

    It appears that Robin is in mid-season form. Sad



    Yeah Rolling Eyes .  In Jackson's first four years he piled up better numbers v. RHers but last two years he's hit LHers better (290) than RHers (249).   But it's still silly, IMO, to consider a guy like that for a platoon role when he's flip-flopped back forth between hitting RHers and LHers better.
    Guys you want to platoon guys are ones who consistently hit opposite handed pitchers better.  Like LaRoche, who's been consistently bad v. LHers for the last 5 years. Garcia has shown some platoon tendencies as he's hit LHers better 3 of 4 years.  But the samples are too small in several of those to draw any real meaningful conclusions. 

    Clearly LaRoche should be platooned.  The only reason I suggested Garcia as his platoon partner is that Jackson is a superior fielder to Garcia and IMO it makes more sense to have a decent fielder rather than a liability in the OF.   If by some miracle Garcia starts hitting, and he could show that against LHers at the outset, he has more power than Jackson.  So then it might make more sense to give Garcia the greater number of AB's, endure his fielding woes, and platoon Jackson.

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2016 8:02 am

    Actually, it makes more sense to play the guy with upside (Garcia) than the guy who appears to be aging prematurely (Jackson)
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:15 am

    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:Actually, it makes more sense to play the guy with upside (Garcia) than the guy who appears to be aging prematurely (Jackson)

    The upside guy first needs to stop looking like a deer in headlights in the outfield.

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:18 am

    rmapasad wrote:
    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:Actually, it makes more sense to play the guy with upside (Garcia) than the guy who appears to be aging prematurely (Jackson)

    The upside guy first needs to stop looking like a deer in headlights in the outfield.



    He'll be nontendered this fall if he doesn't

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:59 am

    rmapasad wrote:
    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:Actually, it makes more sense to play the guy with upside (Garcia) than the guy who appears to be aging prematurely (Jackson)

    The upside guy first needs to stop looking like a deer in headlights in the outfield.



    He'll be nontendered this fall if he doesn't


    EXACTLY - so you find out what you have this season and whether or not you are re-signing him. If he sucks like RMA states, then jettison him. If not, sign him. Let's face it. Sox aren't winning anything of meaning this year - doubt it's another 2005. So why play the Jackson's over Garcia, at least early on in the year. If it turns out they are in the race. Or Garcia does stink up Comiskey, then fine , switch gears.
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Shooters Buffet on Wed Mar 09, 2016 12:42 pm

    I refuse to quit on the season before it starts.


    There are 3 ways to get to the Playoffs.


    I may quit on the season in the 3rd week of April, but not in March.


    BELIEVE!!!!


    CATCH THE FUCKING BALL.
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Wed Mar 09, 2016 5:27 pm

    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:

    He'll be nontendered this fall if he doesn't

    Between spring training and early/mid April games Garcia can show whether he's tracking flyballs and laying off shit pitches. If he can't, dump his ass back to AAA by May.  Why keep nurturing incompetence ? If I'm Manager, everyone who was lousy last year is on the hot seat  (LaRoche, Garcia, Jackson, Rollins, Latos and Danks).  Ventura said LaRoche had to earn his job, so should Jackson and Rollins.  Why should Garcia be guaranteed another lengthy trial like last year just because he's 25 and has theoretical "upside" ? Sox have flogged the "upside" theory too many times with bums like  Beckham, Tank, Flowers, and Gillaspie.  Multiple sources have said the Sox have a shot at the AL Central this year.  Why scuttle that out of a sense of obligation to play fuck-ups with alleged "upside" ?  That movie has run too many times before.

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:51 am

    rmapasad wrote:
    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:

    He'll be nontendered this fall if he doesn't

    Between spring training and early/mid April games Garcia can show whether he's tracking flyballs and laying off shit pitches. If he can't, dump his ass back to AAA by May.  Why keep nurturing incompetence ? If I'm Manager, everyone who was lousy last year is on the hot seat  (LaRoche, Garcia, Jackson, Rollins, Latos and Danks).  Ventura said LaRoche had to earn his job, so should Jackson and Rollins.  Why should Garcia be guaranteed another lengthy trial like last year just because he's 25 and has theoretical "upside" ? Sox have flogged the "upside" theory too many times with bums like  Beckham, Tank, Flowers, and Gillaspie.  Multiple sources have said the Sox have a shot at the AL Central this year.  Why scuttle that out of a sense of obligation to play fuck-ups with alleged "upside" ?  That movie has run too many times before.



    Excuse me, but I clearly recall a few months ago begging for the White Sox to sign guys like Heyward and Cespednes and others that are clearly better than Garcia.

    the White Sox failed to do so

    Instead we get Austin Jackson

    so maybe you should explain why we should be playing guys with no upside simply because they sucked slightly less in 2015.

    You don't win a damn thing replacing a 675OPS with a 696OPS

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Thu Mar 10, 2016 9:38 am

    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:
    rmapasad wrote:
    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:

    He'll be nontendered this fall if he doesn't

    Between spring training and early/mid April games Garcia can show whether he's tracking flyballs and laying off shit pitches. If he can't, dump his ass back to AAA by May.  Why keep nurturing incompetence ? If I'm Manager, everyone who was lousy last year is on the hot seat  (LaRoche, Garcia, Jackson, Rollins, Latos and Danks).  Ventura said LaRoche had to earn his job, so should Jackson and Rollins.  Why should Garcia be guaranteed another lengthy trial like last year just because he's 25 and has theoretical "upside" ? Sox have flogged the "upside" theory too many times with bums like  Beckham, Tank, Flowers, and Gillaspie.  Multiple sources have said the Sox have a shot at the AL Central this year.  Why scuttle that out of a sense of obligation to play fuck-ups with alleged "upside" ?  That movie has run too many times before.



    Excuse me, but I clearly recall a few months ago begging for the White Sox to sign guys like Heyward and Cespednes and others that are clearly better than Garcia.

    the White Sox failed to do so

    Instead we get Austin Jackson

    so maybe you should explain why we should be playing guys with no upside simply because they sucked slightly less in 2015.

    You don't win a damn thing replacing a 675OPS with a 696OPS

    That was basically my point before the signing of Jackson.  You don't replace the young guy with upside with an almost equally sucky veteran going downhill.  Jackson does have defense in his favor, although Garcia was consider good defensively until his shoulder injury.  Perhaps he was playing too timid last season.

    Anyway, Adam Eaton has been DHing in Spring Training games due to off-season shoulder surgery.  I wouldn't be surprised if the Sox signed Jackson with the idea that Eaton would do a lot of DHing early in the season.  At least, Jackson does provide some insurance if that's the case.
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:09 am

    Excuse me, but I clearly recall a few months ago begging for the White Sox to sign guys like Heyward and Cespednes and others that are clearly better than Garcia.   the White Sox failed to do so.  Instead we get Austin Jackson.  so maybe you should explain why we should be playing guys with no upside simply because they sucked slightly less in 2015. You don't win a damn thing replacing a 675OPS with a 696OPS  >>
    Settling for second best is a way of life under Reinsdorf.  Not landing the big fish shouldn't mean Garcia automatically gets another 500 AB's as rightfielder. Not when his poor fielding cost the Sox 15 runs v. an average RFer.  Jackson was 8 runs above average in the field.  If their offense is still a wash (and the projections I've seen claim it will be) then the Sox win more games with Jackson's better glove.

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:22 am

    rmapasad wrote:
    Settling for second best is a way of life under Reinsdorf.  Not landing the big fish shouldn't mean Garcia automatically gets another 500 AB's as rightfielder. Not when his poor fielding cost the Sox 15 runs v. an average RFer.  Jackson was 8 runs above average in the field.  If their offense is still a wash (and the projections I've seen claim it will be) then the Sox win more games with Jackson's better glove.

    Interesting, Roger.  The Sox offense is projected to be as bad as last season?  Please give references to such "projections".

    (p.s. Bobby's "shitshow" opinions do not count as projections, although they may be fairly accurate.) Rolling Eyes
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Thu Mar 10, 2016 11:00 am

    MGJOHNSON wrote:
    rmapasad wrote:
    Jackson was 8 runs above average in the field.  If their offense is still a wash (and the projections I've seen claim it will be) then the Sox win more games with Jackson's better glove.

    Interesting, Roger.  The Sox offense is projected to be as bad as last season?  Please give references to such "projections".

    Meant that projections on Jackson and Garcia's offense were a "wash".   Same sources on Fan Graphs  project the Sox scoring 708 runs this year v. 622 last year.   That's roughly 8 more wins.

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Thu Mar 10, 2016 11:18 am

    rmapasad wrote:Excuse me, but I clearly recall a few months ago begging for the White Sox to sign guys like Heyward and Cespednes and others that are clearly better than Garcia.   the White Sox failed to do so.  Instead we get Austin Jackson.  so maybe you should explain why we should be playing guys with no upside simply because they sucked slightly less in 2015. You don't win a damn thing replacing a 675OPS with a 696OPS  >>
    Settling for second best is a way of life under Reinsdorf.  Not landing the big fish shouldn't mean Garcia automatically gets another 500 AB's as rightfielder.

    ACTUALLY IT DOES.  BECAUSE THE WHITE SOX AIN'T GOT NOBODY BETTER

     Not when his poor fielding cost the Sox 15 runs v. an average RFer.  Jackson was 8 runs above average in the field.  If their offense is still a wash (and the projections I've seen claim it will be) then the Sox win more games with Jackson's better glove.



    SO JACKSON SHOULD PLAY AHEAD OF GARCIA BUT OF SOME COMPUTER MODEL THAT MAKES A LOT OF MISTAKES AND YOU ILLOGICAL ASSUMPTION THAT GARCIA AND JACKSON WILL PRODUCE THE SAME AS THEY DID IN 2015.
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Thu Mar 10, 2016 2:52 pm

    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:
    ACTUALLY IT DOES.  BECAUSE THE WHITE SOX AIN'T GOT NOBODY BETTER
     Not when his poor fielding cost the Sox 15 runs v. an average RFer.  Jackson was 8 runs above average in the field.  If their offense is still a wash (and the projections I've seen claim it will be) then the Sox win more games with Jackson's better glove.

    SO JACKSON SHOULD PLAY AHEAD OF GARCIA BUT OF SOME COMPUTER MODEL THAT MAKES A LOT OF MISTAKES AND YOU ILLOGICAL ASSUMPTION THAT GARCIA AND JACKSON WILL PRODUCE THE SAME AS THEY DID IN 2015.

    Not using one system over one year.  It's three different systems saying the same thing over three successive years - Garcia sucks on defense. Plus fans who saw him play regularly rated him 8 on scale of 100 on Defensive Instincts - (the worst rating of any outfielder in baseball). 
    I think it's very illogical to give a guy the job because he's only 25 when he has major glaring flaws in strike zone judgment and defensive instincts.  His stats not only are underwhelming but going the wrong direction over the last 3 years - 731, 718 and 675.  Jackson's been going the wrong way too, but at least his defense has been stable. 
    But I also agree with Mart that the basic logic of Jackson was added depth.  There are a lot of guys (Cabrera, Eaton, LaRoche and Garcia himself) that haven't been the picture of health and having another warm body was pretty logical.






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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Thu Mar 10, 2016 3:23 pm

    AGAIN, AT BEST YOU ARE BEING PENNY WISE AND POUND FOOLISH.  AS WELL AS BEING STUCK IN THE PAST

    AGAIN, YOU DON'T WIN A DAMN THING BY REPLACING ONE SUB 700OPS GUY WITH ANOTHER NO MATTER WHAT THE DIFFERENCE IN DEFENSE IS.

    AGAIN, IT'S NOT LIKE ANYBODY IS DEMANDING GARCIA OVER ANYBODY THAT IS GOOD.  YOU WANT GARCIA OUT OF THE LINEUP, THEN FIND A WAY TO GET JOSE BAUTISTA ON THE TEAM.  THEN I'LL AGREE THAT GARCIA DOESN'T BELONG IN THE LINE UP
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by rmapasad on Thu Mar 10, 2016 5:54 pm

    tHe SicKo FANt wrote:AGAIN, AT BEST YOU ARE BEING PENNY WISE AND POUND FOOLISH.  AS WELL AS BEING STUCK IN THE PAST

    AGAIN, YOU DON'T WIN A DAMN THING BY REPLACING ONE SUB 700OPS GUY WITH ANOTHER NO MATTER WHAT THE DIFFERENCE IN DEFENSE IS.

    AGAIN, IT'S NOT LIKE ANYBODY IS DEMANDING GARCIA OVER ANYBODY THAT IS GOOD.  YOU WANT GARCIA OUT OF THE LINEUP, THEN FIND A WAY TO GET JOSE BAUTISTA ON THE TEAM.  THEN I'LL AGREE THAT GARCIA DOESN'T BELONG IN THE LINE UP

    LMAO, only a Bautista is worthy enough to displace a guy who's been a STIFF ?  Bautista had a 900 OPS. There were 85 OFers, including Jackson, that were ahead of the 675 Garcia last year.  This is before we talk about his shit defense.   The idea that a guy like that  "belongs in the lineup", is ridiculous. Not only has he done nothing to earn it, his handicaps make it unlikely he ever will.  Luckily for him, he's with an organization that has a long history of ignoring failure, overlooking flaws and banking on the hope that guys will "turn the corner" if given enough chances.
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by jaywit on Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:34 pm

    rmapasad wrote:
     an organization that has a long history of ignoring failure, overlooking flaws and banking on the hope that guys will "turn the corner" if given enough chances.

    Hey, that's our motto you're blasting!
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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by alohafri on Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:52 pm

    Shooters Buffet wrote:I refuse to quit on the season before it starts.


    There are 3 ways to get to the Playoffs.


    I may quit on the season in the 3rd week of April, but not in March.


    BELIEVE!!!!


    CATCH THE FUCKING BALL.

    When the Sox get Joey Votto, you won't be quitting at any time!

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    Re: USA Today 2016 Predictions

    Post by Guest on Thu Mar 10, 2016 9:02 pm

    When the Sox get Joey Votto, you won't be quitting at any time!


    When? in 2025, when he's LaRoche 2?

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