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    Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

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    Hawk Harrelson
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    Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:03 pm

    Rumor has it.
    If the Sox trade Ramirez and Beckham, this will be a tear down and rebuild on a Theo Epstein Cubs scale.
    If anybody bitches, Sox could say nobody bought tickets to see them play, so Fuck Off.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by sox55 on Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:14 pm

    Hawk Harrelson wrote:Rumor has it.
    If the Sox trade Ramirez and Beckham, this will be a tear down and rebuild on a Theo Epstein Cubs scale.
    If anybody bitches, Sox could say nobody bought tickets to see them play, so Fuck Off.
    If that happens, my season tickets are in the past.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:19 pm

    We'll keep sharp objects beyond your reach John.  Very Happy 

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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:11 am

    It would take a hell of a lot more than Dustin Ackley. 

    And they better not be blowing any Smoak our way.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Cream1953 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 6:19 am

    Wonder if the good Pacific Northwest doctor had heard anythnig on this? He hasn't posted in a few days. I kinda miss the insufferable pain in the ass.

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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Guest on Tue Jun 17, 2014 9:51 am

    sox55 wrote:
    Hawk Harrelson wrote:Rumor has it.
    If the Sox trade Ramirez and Beckham, this will be a tear down and rebuild on a Theo Epstein Cubs scale.
    If anybody bitches, Sox could say nobody bought tickets to see them play, so Fuck Off.
    If that happens, my season tickets are in the past.

    1)  The KARK fails to see how this is a complete tear down.
          a) Ramirez is signed thru 2015 at $10 mil plus a $10 mil option for 2016.  Ramirez turns 33 this September.  How much gas is left in his tank?
          b) Beckham has been a disappointment majority of his career.  2015 is his free agent year.  Anybody really want him signed long term?

    2)  The notion that trading these two is the final straw is absurd
          a)  White Sox aren't winning anything this year
          b)  Ramirez and Beckham are completely replaceable
          c)  If you put up with Reinsdorf this long, including being called an asshole to your face, trading 2 mediocrities a year too early instead of a year too late is nothing.

    3)  Outside of Sale and Abreau, nobody on this team is untouchable.  Claiming that dumping a bunch of overpaid mediocrities is some sort of theo movea that would produce Theo results is insane.  2015 is the last year for Ramirez and Beckham anyway.  I doubt anybody would seriously want these two extended.  The same applies to Dunn and Danks.  An intelligent forward looking GM would try to move all 4 by 7/31
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by rmapasad on Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:39 am

    1)  The KARK fails to see how this is a complete tear down.
          a) Ramirez is signed thru 2015 at $10 mil plus a $10 mil option for 2016.  Ramirez turns 33 this September.  How much gas is left in his tank?
          b) Beckham has been a disappointment majority of his career.  2015 is his free agent year.  Anybody really want him signed long term?
    2)  The notion that trading these two is the final straw is absurd
          a)  White Sox aren't winning anything this year
          b)  Ramirez and Beckham are completely replaceable
          c)  If you put up with Reinsdorf this long, including being called an asshole to your face, trading 2 mediocrities a year too early instead of a year too late is nothing.
    3)  Outside of Sale and Abreau, nobody on this team is untouchable.  Claiming that dumping a bunch of overpaid mediocrities is some sort of theo movea that would produce Theo results is insane.  2015 is the last year for Ramirez and Beckham anyway.  I doubt anybody would seriously want these two extended.  The same applies to Dunn and Danks.  An intelligent forward looking GM would try to move all 4 by 7/31  >>>


    Kark, both Ramirez and Beckham won't be free agents until 2016. Technically the Sox could keep Ramirez even in 2016 if they exercise his option.   Alexei's trade value won't get any higher-he's hitting over .300  (which he won't keep up) and his glove is above average but he's slipping from his elite level of previous years. But the Sox don't really have a suitable replacement for him in the minors.  If Sox expect to contend in 2015 -2016,  he may be the only realistic alternative at SS..

    Both Semien and Johnson could be options to take over at 2b by 2016 and possibly 2015. But Sox could hold onto Beckham through 2015 if neither is ready by then.  Beckham may cost $ 6 million in arb for 2015 which is a bit much but at least he doesn't create a big problem at 2b.  He's currently 17th ranked 2bman in baseball and has been in the bottom 10 for last 4 years. Doubtful any club would give up enough for Beckham to make a trade that worthwhile. They should absolutely trade him in 2015 though.. Even if it's for a longshot prospect.












     

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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Guest on Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:41 pm

    Beckham will have over 6 years of service after next year making 2015 his free agent year. Ramirez will be a free agent after the 2015 season unless the Sox pick up his 2016 option for 10mil which would be foolish

    Sox won't contend in 2015 due to the odd number year jinx
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by sox55 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:43 pm

    THE KARK wrote:Beckham will have over 6 years of service after next year making 2015 his free agent year.  Ramirez will be a free agent after the 2015 season unless the Sox pick up his 2016 option for 10mil which would be foolish

    Sox won't contend in 2015 due to the odd number year jinx
    Was 2005 an "even" year?
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by rmapasad on Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:29 pm

    Beckham will have over 6 years of service after next year making 2015 his free agent year. Ramirez will be a free agent after the 2015 season unless the Sox pick up his 2016 option for 10mil which would be foolish>
    OK, I see you're defining a guy's 6th service year as his "free agent season", where I was calling it the year he actually becomes a free agent.  Sox could still keep Beckham in 2015 on a one-year arb deal and I think it's possible Hahn may wait the rest of this year to see how Semien and Johnson are doing before deciding what to do with Beckham.  It's possible that one contender (Oakland A's) could be interested in Beckham come this July but very doubtful they would offer their top SS prospect, Adam Russell, for him. 
    As to Ramirez, Sox need to start thinking about his replacement for 2016 fairly soon, otherwise they may be picking up that 2016 option due to lack of any other solutions.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by sox55 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:21 pm

    rmapasad wrote:Beckham will have over 6 years of service after next year making 2015 his free agent year. Ramirez will be a free agent after the 2015 season unless the Sox pick up his 2016 option for 10mil which would be foolish>
    OK, I see you're defining a guy's 6th service year as his "free agent season", where I was calling it the year he actually becomes a free agent.  Sox could still keep Beckham in 2015 on a one-year arb deal and I think it's possible Hahn may wait the rest of this year to see how Semien and Johnson are doing before deciding what to do with Beckham.  It's possible that one contender (Oakland A's) could be interested in Beckham come this July but very doubtful they would offer their top SS prospect, Adam Russell, for him. 
    As to Ramirez, Sox need to start thinking about his replacement for 2016 fairly soon, otherwise they may be picking up that 2016 option due to lack of any other solutions.
    Beckham isn't going anywhere soon. 
    The team is being re-built around Sale, Abreu and him.

    You can relate all the new millennium stats you want, I watch him play everyday and I wouldn't want anyone else at 2nd base for the next few years.

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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Guest on Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:09 pm

    You don't need some new age voodoo stats to figure out Beckham has been a huge disappointment prior to this year. Sure he's batting 280 now, but that could be just luck. I doubt that he has turned any kind of corner.

    Trade him this July while you can still fool somebody
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Cream1953 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:20 pm

    You can relate all the new millennium stats you want, I watch him play everyday and I wouldn't want anyone else at 2nd base for the next few years.

    *************************************************

    Not that John gives a shit what happens to Beckham one way or another.  lol!  lol!  lol! 

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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Guest on Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:33 pm

    sox55 wrote:
    THE KARK wrote:Beckham will have over 6 years of service after next year making 2015 his free agent year.  Ramirez will be a free agent after the 2015 season unless the Sox pick up his 2016 option for 10mil which would be foolish

    Sox won't contend in 2015 due to the odd number year jinx
    Was 2005 an "even" year?


    Odd year jinx started in 2007
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by rmapasad on Tue Jun 17, 2014 7:19 pm

    Beckham isn't going anywhere soon.  The team is being re-built around Sale, Abreu and him. You can relate all the new millennium stats you want, I watch him play everyday and I wouldn't want anyone else at 2nd base for the next few years. >>
    I agree that until either Johnson or Semien start beating down the door  the Sox won't get rid of Beckham this year or even next.  He isn't a liability that needs to be fixed.  But, IMO, he isn't so much of an asset that he should be offered a big extension to keep him into his free agent years.   
    Forget "new millineum" stats, he's a .250 career hitter and not many GM's would consider that someone to build around for the future unless the guy possesses an Ozzie Smith-like defensive skills.  I will defend the newer defensive stats.  They are not dreamed up by a kid sitting in his mom's basement on his computer, but they are put together by a company called Baseball Information Solutions, who employ professional WATCHERS.  Their job is to watch both live and video replays of all defensive plays by players and determine how many plays a guy makes v. other guys at his position.  BIS and another rating system called UZR consistently show Beckham is an above average defensive 2bman but not among the elite glove guys.  I would bet that Hahn is the kind of GM who would at least look at BIS and give it some credence.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by sox55 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 7:33 pm

    rmapasad wrote:Beckham isn't going anywhere soon.  The team is being re-built around Sale, Abreu and him. You can relate all the new millennium stats you want, I watch him play everyday and I wouldn't want anyone else at 2nd base for the next few years. >>
    I agree that until either Johnson or Semien start beating down the door  the Sox won't get rid of Beckham this year or even next.  He isn't a liability that needs to be fixed.  But, IMO, he isn't so much of an asset that he should be offered a big extension to keep him into his free agent years.   
    Forget "new millineum" stats, he's a .250 career hitter and not many GM's would consider that someone to build around for the future unless the guy possesses an Ozzie Smith-like defensive skills.  I will defend the newer defensive stats.  They are not dreamed up by a kid sitting in his mom's basement on his computer, but they are put together by a company called Baseball Information Solutions, who employ professional WATCHERS.  Their job is to watch both live and video replays of all defensive plays by players and determine how many plays a guy makes v. other guys at his position.  BIS and another rating system called UZR consistently show Beckham is an above average defensive 2bman but not among the elite glove guys.  I would bet that Hahn is the kind of GM who would at least look at BIS and give it some credence.
    Ask Paul Konerko what he thinks about the new millennium stats!!

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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Guest on Tue Jun 17, 2014 7:43 pm

    I agree that until either Johnson or Semien start beating down the door  the Sox won't get rid of Beckham this year or even next.  He isn't a liability that needs to be fixed.  But, IMO, he isn't so much of an asset that he should be offered a big extension to keep him into his free agent years.   
    Forget "new millineum" stats, he's a .250 career hitter and not many GM's would consider that someone to build around for the future unless the guy possesses an Ozzie Smith-like defensive skills.  I will defend the newer defensive stats.  They are not dreamed up by a kid sitting in his mom's basement on his computer, but they are put together by a company called Baseball Information Solutions, who employ professional WATCHERS.  Their job is to watch both live and video replays of all defensive plays by players and determine how many plays a guy makes v. other guys at his position.  BIS and another rating system called UZR consistently show Beckham is an above average defensive 2bman but not among the elite glove guys.  I would bet that Hahn is the kind of GM who would at least look at BIS and give it some credence.


    With all due respect. You have all these computer generated stats, do you think you can figure out how to highlight, erase, and edit?  It's getting to the point where you can write out the formula for immortality but you're so hard to read I just skip it.  Edit man, EDIT!
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Tue Jun 17, 2014 7:48 pm

    What happened to that joke of a stat RANGE FACTOR???


    What a load of shit.


    Jose Valentin had all of this RANGE.


    The STIFF could not hit a ground ball hit right to him!!!!
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Tue Jun 17, 2014 7:55 pm

    What kind of logic is YOU WILL NOT GET ANYTHING FOR BECKHAM, SO TRADE HIM?


    Fuck these stats.


    How about you take a look at the horseshit A.L. Central.


    If you don't want to sign them, fine.  But the history of this jackass club has been trade a guy with no replacement in sight.


    I have confidence that in this stupid division in this useless MLB, Hahn can put a contender out there in 2015.  He is not going to bring in washed up injured bums like Williams.  Get these pitchers straightened out and tighten up the DEFENSE.
    The trade deadline is 6 weeks away and people are writing off 2015 in this Modern Era of Mediocrity?  I am not writing off next year unless Hahn pulls an Epstein and unloads the whole bunch.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by sox55 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 8:18 pm

    sox55 wrote:
    rmapasad wrote:Beckham isn't going anywhere soon.  The team is being re-built around Sale, Abreu and him. You can relate all the new millennium stats you want, I watch him play everyday and I wouldn't want anyone else at 2nd base for the next few years. >>
    I agree that until either Johnson or Semien start beating down the door  the Sox won't get rid of Beckham this year or even next.  He isn't a liability that needs to be fixed.  But, IMO, he isn't so much of an asset that he should be offered a big extension to keep him into his free agent years.   
    Forget "new millineum" stats, he's a .250 career hitter and not many GM's would consider that someone to build around for the future unless the guy possesses an Ozzie Smith-like defensive skills.  I will defend the newer defensive stats.  They are not dreamed up by a kid sitting in his mom's basement on his computer, but they are put together by a company called Baseball Information Solutions, who employ professional WATCHERS.  Their job is to watch both live and video replays of all defensive plays by players and determine how many plays a guy makes v. other guys at his position.  BIS and another rating system called UZR consistently show Beckham is an above average defensive 2bman but not among the elite glove guys.  I would bet that Hahn is the kind of GM who would at least look at BIS and give it some credence.
    Ask Paul Konerko what he thinks about the new millennium stats!!
    Forgot this article from the LA Times last week:


    http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-baseball-shaikin-20140608-story.html
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Tue Jun 17, 2014 8:45 pm

    Imagine THAT!!!




    A REAL ballplayer thinking all of these stats are BULLSHIT!!!
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by Cream1953 on Tue Jun 17, 2014 10:07 pm

    It's getting to the point where you can write out the formula for immortality but you're so hard to read I just skip it. Edit man, EDIT!

    *******************************************************************************

    No shit. My figures indicate that 97.3% of the board have trouble reading these posts!  study 
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by rmapasad on Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:56 pm

    No shit. My figures indicate that 97.3% of the board have trouble reading these posts!   >>

    Yeah, it is frustrating for me too.. When someone posts in the big fonts and I try to respond in the smaller font it comes out in different sizes with all the formatting codes in there.  Those codes don't show up in the preview either.  Just will stick to the small fonts.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by rmapasad on Wed Jun 18, 2014 1:15 am

    Ask Paul Konerko what he thinks about the new millennium stats!!Forgot this article from the LA Times last week:>

    I suppose that Billy Beane will stop looking at stats now that Konerko has spoken.
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    Re: Seattle interested In Alexei Ramirez?

    Post by sox55 on Wed Jun 18, 2014 2:58 am

    rmapasad wrote:Ask Paul Konerko what he thinks about the new millennium stats!!Forgot this article from the LA Times last week:>

    I suppose that Billy Beane will stop looking at stats now that Konerko has spoken.
    Konerko has a ring, Billy Beane does not.

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