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    Philip Seymour Hoffman

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    alohafri
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    Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by alohafri on Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:30 am

    I don't mean to sound crass, but what do you think the first clue was that he died of a heroin overdose? Maybe the needle in his arm?
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:13 am

    Heard that.  Good God.  How do you overuse something to the degree that you don't even have time to pull the fucking needle out of your arm before you are dead?
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:16 am

    On a separate note, I'll really miss seeing the guy in film.  He was always somewhere north of outstanding in ever role he played.  Always played a very complicated person.  Sad to see him go.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:25 am

    Spike yourself with some bad shit and death can be instantaneous. Many years ago a friend of mine checked out that way. When I first heard of Hoffman's death the first thought that popped into my mind was drugs. Is that jaded or what? The guy had supposedly been clean for over 20 years and relapsed. If true, it's just further evidence as to how insidious addictions can be. A former sponser of mine relapsed after 28 years of being clean and sober. This notion that addictions can be "cured" is just pure bullshit and a lie. A true addict knows better.


    Last edited by Cream1953 on Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:25 am

    Cream1953 wrote:Spike yourself with some bad shit and death can be instantaneous. Many years ago a friend of mine checked out that way. When I first heard of his death the first thought that popped into my mind was drugs. Is that jaded or what? The guy had supposedly been clean for over 20 years and relapsed. If true, it's just further evidence as to how insidious addictions can be. A former sponser of mine relapsed after 28 years of being clean and sober. This notion that addictions can be "cured" is just pure bullshit and a lie. A true addict knows better.

    I agree.  Seems like at best, an addiction can become controlled.  Never cured.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by jaywit on Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:45 pm

    Soxillinirob wrote:On a separate note, I'll really miss seeing the guy in film.  He was always somewhere north of outstanding in ever role he played.  Always played a very complicated person.  Sad to see him go.

    Agree completely.  I never saw him in a film where he wasn't outstanding and equal to or above the other big-named and pretty actors.  Held his own and then some with Streep in that movie about the molesting priest.  One of my favorite actors who made it big despite his non-Hollywood looks.  As to how he died, it's sad and I hold nothing against him.  I'll steal a line from Royko when Belushi died of an OD when Royko was addressing the dolts who cynically sneered at the manner of death:  "I'm still blue, brother."


    Last edited by jaywit on Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 1:39 pm

    jaywit wrote:
    Soxillinirob wrote:On a separate note, I'll really miss seeing the guy in film.  He was always somewhere north of outstanding in ever role he played.  Always played a very complicated person.  Sad to see him go.

    Agree completely.  I never saw him in a film where he wasn't outstanding and equal to or above the other big-named and pretty actors.  Held his own and then some with Streep in that movie about the molesting priest.  One of my favorite actors who made it big despite his non-Hollywood looks.  As to how he died, it's sad and I hold nothing against him.  I'll steal a line from Royko when Belushi died of an OD when he was addressing the dolts who cynically sneered at the manner of death:  "I'm still blue, brother."

    Loved Royko.  I liken death by OD to being similar to dying for mental illness related causes.  True, it required action by Seymour Hoofman to actually put the needle in his arm, but I can't help but believe that someone so addicted to a deadly drug must be extremely mentally ill in order to inject it into oneself.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Father of Satan on Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:03 pm

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    jaywit wrote:
    Soxillinirob wrote:On a separate note, I'll really miss seeing the guy in film.  He was always somewhere north of outstanding in ever role he played.  Always played a very complicated person.  Sad to see him go.

    Agree completely.  I never saw him in a film where he wasn't outstanding and equal to or above the other big-named and pretty actors.  Held his own and then some with Streep in that movie about the molesting priest.  One of my favorite actors who made it big despite his non-Hollywood looks.  As to how he died, it's sad and I hold nothing against him.  I'll steal a line from Royko when Belushi died of an OD when he was addressing the dolts who cynically sneered at the manner of death:  "I'm still blue, brother."

    Loved Royko.  I liken death by OD to being similar to dying for mental illness related causes.  True, it required action by Seymour Hoofman to actually put the needle in his arm, but I can't help but believe that someone so addicted to a deadly drug must be extremely mentally ill in order to inject it into oneself.

    Ahem!
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:07 pm

    Sadly, sometimes the dragon wins. There are several actors and actresses out there walking around with a monkey on their back. Robert Downy Jr. and Drew Barrymore are two hard-core cases who came immediately to mind in terms of making a seemingly nice turnaround. I sincerely hope they can keep it up.

    As for musicians, Jesus, just too many to mention. So many have lost the fight. Ozzy and Steve Tyler both seem to be riding an ongoing roller coaster. My man Clapton has been clean for 25 years plus...stayed straight even after the tragic death of his son...yet he STILL does his 12-step groups and has even built a first-class treatment center for addicts. His annual "Crossroads Festival" helps raise funds to assist those who can't afford to pay for the treatment they recieve at his facility. Nevertheless, through it all, Eric will be the first to tell you that he is not "cured".
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:17 pm

    Cream1953 wrote:Sadly, sometimes the dragon wins. There are several actors and actresses out there walking around with a monkey on their back. Robert Downy Jr. and Drew Barrymore are two hard-core cases who came immediately to mind in terms of making a seemingly nice turnaround. I sincerely hope they can keep it up.

    I can easily envision Downey taking further turns for the worse.  I think he's only a few years removed from wandering into neighbors' homes and sleeping in their beds after going on a bender.  Drew Barrymore seems enough years removed from it that it'd surprise me if she went back to the dark side.  In fact, I haven't really ever heard if she was an addict, or just a user. 

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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:16 pm

    If anyone ever had a genetic predisposition towards addictions it was Drew. The Barrymore family was notorious for their alcoholism. There's an old  picture floating around of her pie-faced drunk...I think she might have been 9 when it was taken.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:36 pm

    I remember Drew coming to speak at the high school where I taught circa '91 or '92.  She was a mere teen...16 or 17.  She told stories of her many times being high, drunk, stoned, wasted, blacked out, sleeping with multitudes of men whose names she didn't know.  I was absolutely stunned that this poor girl didn't have a parent that gave a shit enough to even care where she was.  Her stories included being a complete drunk and stoner by the age of 11 or 12.  I believe she was on some kind of probationary speaking tour as a part of a juvenile sentence she'd rec'd from some judge.  I recall thinking that any parent that allowed a kid to fall into a spiral like that ought to be in jail.

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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Guest on Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:57 pm


    I recall thinking that any parent that allowed a kid to fall into a spiral like that ought to be in jail.







    Don't think I agree with you that parents can prevent their kid from spiraling out of control. Seems to be a lot of drug addicts who grew up in good homes with loving parents ....think ur underestimating the ability of an addict to be an addict, no matter what others try to do. When your kid becomes more independent, learns to drive, friends learn to drive, goes off to college, you will realize how little actual "control" you have over them. You hope you've taught them right, scared them to stay straight, and that your morals and values have dribbled down to them, but if you think that's a "given", you're mistaken.

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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:31 pm

    She was living the life of a whore and a drug addict by the age of 11 or 12.  You can't prevent drug urges and whore urges, but when your kid is 11 can't you just keep him under lock and key? 

    I have no expectation that I will be able to keep my kid from turning to booze or drugs or whatever else after they turn around 15 or 16.  I just can't imagine having an 11 yr old who is on drugs.  For me, at least, that's a parent REALLY taking his eyes off the ball.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:53 pm

    Rob, to your credit, you speak from the point of view of a responsible parent. Sharpy's right that sometimes it doesn't matter how hard you try as a parent, a kid sometimes just turns out crazy. On the other hand, someone like Barrymore never had much of a chance to begin with since the whole family basically consisted of one train wreck after another. 

    Back to Hoffman, reports are now that they've hauled 50 packets of heroin out of his place. When things have gone that far south, I can't help but wonder if his years of "recovery" where all that many...if it all. NEVER forget that "active" hardcore addicts are master liars and manipulators. Hell, they can't even be honest with themselves...how the hell are they ever expected to be honest and upfront with others?
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Tue Feb 04, 2014 8:06 am

    Cream1953 wrote:Rob, to your credit, you speak from the point of view of a responsible parent. Sharpy's right that sometimes it doesn't matter how hard you try as a parent, a kid sometimes just turns out crazy. On the other hand, someone like Barrymore never had much of a chance to begin with since the whole family basically consisted of one train wreck after another. 


    I completely agree, Cream.  I was really just pointing out that I can't understand a parent that would allow their kid to be out partying with drugs and hookers and having sex in their pre teen and early teen years.  Granted, Drew might have been the epitome of a crazy kid, and surely her parents were non existent in those years.  My reference to arresting the parents is just a response to them allowing their daughter to ever be IN those situations.  Sounds like being in that family put her squarely behind the 8 ball.  Figuratively and literally.

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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Guest on Tue Feb 04, 2014 6:21 pm

    I was really just pointing out that I can't understand a parent that would allow their kid to be out partying with drugs and hookers and having sex in their pre teen and early teen years.  Granted, Drew might have been the epitome of a crazy kid, and surely her parents were non existent in those years.  My reference to arresting the parents is just a response to them allowing their daughter to ever be IN those situations.

     Hollywood people live in a world much different from our norm. Ghetto parents/kids live in a world much different from our norm. It seems like it would be "easy" to keep Drew Barrymore from all these troubles. But she had access to everything and was an actress who at age 8 was nominated for major awards for ET and won a Young Artist Award. She was wined and dined by very immoral and shitty people.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:02 pm

    Chi-kid wrote:But she had access to everything and was an actress who at age 8 was nominated for major awards for ET and won a Young Artist Award. She was wined and dined by very immoral and shitty people.[/size]

    Come on, Tim.  Seriously.  Would you not be by your eight year old's side during times like these?  You know those people are immoral, and shitty.  Of course you would be with your eight year old.  Show of hands...who here wouldn't be by their little eight year old girl's side at these Hollywood parties?  If my wife or I (or a nanny or family member I trust) couldn't be there, then my kid wouldn't be able to attend.  There is no way in hell she should have been allowed to get away with that kind of shit.  When your kid gets into his mid teens, then you of course cannot keep your eyes squarely on them at all times.  I stand by my point that Drew's situation as an early and mid teen is very much on the shoulders of her parents.  They owed her, at the bare minimum, some minimum fucking degree of parenting and supervision.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by alohafri on Wed Feb 05, 2014 4:59 am

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    Chi-kid wrote:But she had access to everything and was an actress who at age 8 was nominated for major awards for ET and won a Young Artist Award. She was wined and dined by very immoral and shitty people.[/size]

    Come on, Tim.  Seriously.  Would you not be by your eight year old's side during times like these?  

    Not if he was as drunk as the Barrymores.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Cream1953 on Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:21 am

    Exactly. She didn't even have her extended family to depend on. The Barrymores had generations worth of being dysfunctional. Massively talented but very fucked-up people.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Wed Feb 05, 2014 10:11 am

    Cream1953 wrote:Exactly. She didn't even have her extended family to depend on. The Barrymores had generations worth of being dysfunctional. Massively talented but very fucked-up people.

    Agreed, but my original point was that that kind of parenting is borderline criminal...allowing a little girl to be tossed to these kinds of wolves.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by alohafri on Wed Feb 05, 2014 10:15 am

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    Cream1953 wrote:Exactly. She didn't even have her extended family to depend on. The Barrymores had generations worth of being dysfunctional. Massively talented but very fucked-up people.

    Agreed, but my original point was that that kind of parenting is borderline criminal...allowing a little girl to be tossed to these kinds of wolves.

    Sometimes, and I think that this is a case, you are a bad parent because your parents were bad parents. If you never have a positive model, you don't know any better.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Soxillinirob on Wed Feb 05, 2014 10:53 am

    alohafri wrote:
    Sometimes, and I think that this is a case, you are a bad parent because your parents were bad parents. If you never have a positive model, you don't know any better.

    Then my kids are fucked.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by alohafri on Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:01 am

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    alohafri wrote:
    Sometimes, and I think that this is a case, you are a bad parent because your parents were bad parents. If you never have a positive model, you don't know any better.

    Then my kids are fucked.

    Just keep the Malort out of the house. They'll be fine.
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    Re: Philip Seymour Hoffman

    Post by Father of Satan on Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:29 am

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    alohafri wrote:
    Sometimes, and I think that this is a case, you are a bad parent because your parents were bad parents. If you never have a positive model, you don't know any better.

    Then my kids are fucked.

    Yes they are!!!

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