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    hardly knew him

    Post by Guest on Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:21 pm


     
    Addison Reed traded for some minor leaguer named Matt Davidson a 3bman ...5 yrs in the minors with a .268 average and .351 OBP, 803 OPS
     
    Always have a problem trading a proven major leaguer whose service they control x 5 more years for a minor league unknown ...on the surface, not enthralled by this deal. Seems like a desperation move to just get a body for 3b....hopefully I am wrong and he's the best 3b prospect since a guy named Traynor.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:34 pm

    Wow.  Seems like we more or less just gave him away, based on the minor league infielder numbers above.

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Guest on Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:55 pm


    Some more about our new hero ...from MLB.com


     

    Davidson, ranked by MLB.com as the D-backs' No. 2 prospect, made his Major League debut last year and hit .237 in 87 plate appearances after having an on-base plus slugging percentage of .831 at Triple-A Reno. He was the MVP at the 2013 SiriusXM All-Star Futures Game.[/i]
    Drafted by the D-backs in the first round (35th overall) in the 2009 First-Year Player Draft, Davidson became expendable when the team acquired third baseman Martin Prado prior to last season[/i]

     
     
    So he's the #2 prospect in their system ....hopefully it will pan out for the Sox ...


    Last edited by Chi-kid on Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by jaywit on Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:57 pm

    Who's closing?
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by alohafri on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:02 pm

    jaywit wrote:Who's closing?

    Maybe Father of Satan will close.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:04 pm

    jaywit wrote:Who's closing?

    I can see that being a "By Committee" thing going into spring, but closers seem to identify themselves early enough.  Conventional wisdom says you develop closers from within your system since there's usually a guy or two in the system throwing the ball near 100 mph.  Nate Jones? 

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Guest on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:04 pm


    And Gavin Floyd signs with the Braves for $4.5 million dollars.   Gavin Fuckin Floyd??? recovering from tommy john surgery and not expected to pitch until MAYBE late in the season....for $4.5 million dollars????  
    That's just fuckin ridiculous.


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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Guest on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:06 pm

    Conventional wisdom says you develop closers from within your system since there's usually a guy or two in the system throwing the ball near 100 mph.  Nate Jones? 







    Have you heard?  Has he discovered where exactly home plate is located so that his pitches get near it consistently??
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by alohafri on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:09 pm

    Chi-kid wrote:
    And Gavin Floyd signs with the Braves for $4.5 million dollars.   Gavin Fuckin Floyd??? recovering from tommy john surgery and not expected to pitch until MAYBE late in the season....for $4.5 million dollars????  
    That's just fuckin ridiculous.



    You want to see ridiculous? Wait until you see what I do with the $565 million I win in Megamillions!
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by jaywit on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:13 pm

    I can see the wisdom of trading a closer from a 99 loss team to potentially fill a big hole in the line-up.  Really, what's the difference between an above average closer like Reed and a "by committee" closer;  about 4-5 more blown saves per season?  That difference won't keep the Sox out of last place.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by jaywit on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:15 pm

    alohafri wrote:
    Chi-kid wrote:
    And Gavin Floyd signs with the Braves for $4.5 million dollars.   Gavin Fuckin Floyd??? recovering from tommy john surgery and not expected to pitch until MAYBE late in the season....for $4.5 million dollars????  
    That's just fuckin ridiculous.



    You want to see ridiculous? Wait until you see what I do with the $565 million I win in Megamillions!


    You gonna buy a double-wide like some winner from Georgia did a few years ago?
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by alohafri on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:22 pm

    jaywit wrote:
    alohafri wrote:
    Chi-kid wrote:
    And Gavin Floyd signs with the Braves for $4.5 million dollars.   Gavin Fuckin Floyd??? recovering from tommy john surgery and not expected to pitch until MAYBE late in the season....for $4.5 million dollars????  
    That's just fuckin ridiculous.



    You want to see ridiculous? Wait until you see what I do with the $565 million I win in Megamillions!


    You gonna buy a double-wide like some winner from Georgia did a few years ago?

    Right after I buy the company that makes Malort.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:25 pm

    Chi-kid wrote:Conventional wisdom says you develop closers from within your system since there's usually a guy or two in the system throwing the ball near 100 mph.  Nate Jones? 







    Have you heard?  Has he discovered where exactly home plate is located so that his pitches get near it consistently??


    Glad to hear it.  Did he use a navigation system? 
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Soxillinirob on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:26 pm

    jaywit wrote:I can see the wisdom of trading a closer from a 99 loss team to potentially fill a big hole in the line-up.  Really, what's the difference between an above average closer like Reed and a "by committee" closer;  about 4-5 more blown saves per season?  That difference won't keep the Sox out of last place.


    And that's assuming we can actually call him above average.  At times he looked great.  Other times....hide your eyes. 
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by alohafri on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:29 pm

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    jaywit wrote:I can see the wisdom of trading a closer from a 99 loss team to potentially fill a big hole in the line-up.  Really, what's the difference between an above average closer like Reed and a "by committee" closer;  about 4-5 more blown saves per season?  That difference won't keep the Sox out of last place.


    And that's assuming we can actually call him above average.  At times he looked great.  Other times....hide your eyes. 

    Other times, he was like a smaller Bobby Jenks.

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Guest on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:32 pm


    The conventional wisdom is that you trade any pitcher for a player who is going to contribute every day - so if Davidson can do that, I'd have traded Sale for him ...the big question as always for the Sox is ....IF?
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by alohafri on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:39 pm

    Chi-kid wrote:
    The conventional wisdom is that you trade any pitcher for a player who is going to contribute every day - so if Davidson can do that, I'd have traded Sale for him ...the big question as always for the Sox is ....IF?


    Yeah, I still don't trust their scouts much.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Nomads44 on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:40 pm

    Pretty Nice Trade presuming Reed was another Drama Queen Jenks in waiting.

    Davidson for the past four years (including this past month) BBAmerica ratings.

    3 yrs ago - #3 Arizona prospect, #99 of top 100 in pre-season
    2 yrs ago - #5 Arizona prospect, #97 of top 100
    last year - #4 Arizona prospect, #88 overall
    this year - #4 prospect again, overall ratings not yet released

    Arizona's #1 - Superb season Archie Bradley (#1 pick in 2011), may vie for rotation spot already
    #2 - P Braden Shipley (don't know much about him)
    #3 - possible (likely) starting SS Chris Owings
    #4 - Davidson

    Being #4 behind Bradley and Owings not really a negative.

    Minor league numbers .... http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=davids002mat

    Fielding numbers not very impressive to me, and no really outstanding season, but the scouts must see something to keep him showing up in the top 100.

    Reed for comparison, when he was our #1 prospect was rated #66 overall.

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:47 pm

    Wow!  The Sox got Matt Davidson, the guy that the Dbacks have been hyping up as the future across-the-diamond bookend to Paul Goldschmidt, for only Addison Reed!  It looks like a steal for Hahn!
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by jaywit on Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:59 pm

    MGJOHNSON wrote:Wow!  The Sox got Matt Davidson, the guy that the Dbacks have been hyping up as the future across-the-diamond bookend to Paul Goldschmidt, for only Addison Reed!  It looks like a steal for Hahn!


    Praising a Sox move is always met with a large degree of skepticism and expectation of irony.  You messing with us?

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:08 pm

    Soxillinirob wrote:
    Chi-kid wrote:Conventional wisdom says you develop closers from within your system since there's usually a guy or two in the system throwing the ball near 100 mph.  Nate Jones? 







    Have you heard?  Has he discovered where exactly home plate is located so that his pitches get near it consistently??


    Glad to hear it.  Did he use a navigation system? 

    Nate Jones got off to a terrible start last season, but was very effective for the most part thereafter.  Matt Lindstrom had 23 saves in 2010 for the Astros, and the Sox recently signed Ron Belisario. Hard throwing youngster Jake Petricka might also figure into the mix.  I doubt if the Sox will go with a committee.  They will probably settle on one guy to close before the start of the season.

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:11 pm

    jaywit wrote:
    MGJOHNSON wrote:Wow!  The Sox got Matt Davidson, the guy that the Dbacks have been hyping up as the future across-the-diamond bookend to Paul Goldschmidt, for only Addison Reed!  It looks like a steal for Hahn!


    Praising a Sox move is always met with a large degree of skepticism and expectation of irony.  You messing with us?

    As a Sox fan, I love the trade.  As a Diamondbacks' fan, I wondering WTF...

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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:25 pm

    Hahn must be running things.  Kenny Williams would have probably thrown in both Erik Johnson and Marcus Semien along with Reed to sweeten the deal.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by Cream1953 on Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:33 pm

    You know you're not really looking forward to the upcoming season when the first thought that comes to mind whenever the Sox give up someone is "I don't give a fuck". Maybe that's a good thing. One of these newbies might actually turn out pretty decent. You know what they say....even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then. On the other hand, this is the White Sox. With another team Reed will probably turn into the second coming of Dennis Eckersley.
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    Re: hardly knew him

    Post by rmapasad on Mon Dec 16, 2013 4:43 pm

    I can see the wisdom of trading a closer from a 99 loss team to potentially fill a big hole in the line-up.  Really, what's the difference between an above average closer like Reed and a "by committee" closer;  about 4-5 more blown saves per season?  That difference won't keep the Sox out of last place. >>


    In 2013 the win differential between the best closer and worst was 6 games.  Depending on the stat used, Reed was basically league average or below average. But let's given him benefit of doubt, even though he had 2nd highest # blown saves in majors, and say he was league average.  So we are talking about 3 games difference in either direction. To your point, 3 wins more or less for 2014 Sox isn't likely going to matter  a whole helluva lot.
    League average 3bman (which is Davidson's upside) are harder to come by than league average closers, so this trade in theory makes sense.  It looks to 2015/beyond when Davidson will likely be more of an impact player.  Sox also have time to audition new candidates and/or grab free agents for closer by then.
    Question is how much of an impact player Davidson will be.  There are some concerns about his defense at 3b which is why Arizona may have considered him expendable.  His offense looks somewhat comparable to Joe Crede (20-30 HR power, .250-.260 Bat Avg) but with more walks.  If his glove isn't good enough for 3b, then he becomes a future DH. That  lessens his value but doesn't make him useless.
    IMO, these last two trades shows that Hahn's philosophy seems to be pretty sound.  Trade young pitching talent which is a little easier to come by (erratic hard throwers like Reed and Santiago) for young hitters with good on-base skills at spots where talent is more scarce (CF and 3b).  The only way this backfires is if the young pitchers gain better command and become more dominant and the young hitters just don't develop.  But there are no guarantees when dealing with 23-25 year olds "with potential".
    Ideally Sox could have snagged a guy like Davidson for a veteran in a midseason deal.  But giving up a young semi-shaky closer is probably not going to be a big loss to the Sox in the long run.

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