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    Rick Hahn's "Plan"

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    sox55
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    Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by sox55 on Wed Jul 31, 2013 4:35 pm

    Like they said in Jersey Boys about what happened when Sherry was released:"THE WHOLE WORLD EXPLODED" will REPEAT when Bobby gets back from vacation and finds out that WIN NOW, version 2014, is Hahn's "plan".

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Guest on Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:31 pm

    How does tarding Peavy fit into WIN NOw???

    Are the Sox planning on spending a bundle on free agents this winter?
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    Cream1953
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:50 pm

    Sometimes I wonder where John gets his info.

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by winstonage on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:26 pm

    Cream1953 wrote:Sometimes I wonder where John gets his info.

     I think Hahn's plan is Kenny's plan. I am from now on going to refer to Kenny as Kenny "Pulford" I was really hoping Hahn would be allowed to be his own man. This team is going to wallow in the shit as long as Williams is there, and he has a life time job. Reinsdorfs life that is.
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:50 pm

    I've said it time and again and I'll say it again....Williams has NOT quietly faded away. His mark is all over this team and the notion that he was just going to turn things over to Hahn and slip into the corner is ludicrous. Man seems to have waaaayyyy to much ego for that to happen. I think Hahn is little more than Kenny's toady.

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Guest on Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:39 am

    Is the KARK the only one that is happy that the architect of 2005 is still around?

    And is it Williams fault the YOUNG MILLIONIARES choked up a 3 game lead with 2 weeks to go in 2012?

    White Sox will be back a hell of a lot faster than most here think. Even year magic is a very real trend
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    Cream1953
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:42 am

    Is the KARK the only one that is happy that the architect of 2005 is still around?

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    Ummmm....yes you are.
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    Cream1953
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:43 am

    And is it Williams fault the YOUNG MILLIONIARES choked up a 3 game lead with 2 weeks to go in 2012?

    *************************************************************************

    Ummm...yes it is.

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:36 am

    Cream1953 wrote:I've said it time and again and I'll say it again....Williams has NOT quietly faded away. His mark is all over this team and the notion that he was just going to turn things over to Hahn and slip into the corner is ludicrous. Man seems to have waaaayyyy to much ego for that to happen. I think Hahn is little more than Kenny's toady.

    Well, if Hahn is KW's toady, and I'm not sure that he is, it's because Reinsdorf wants it that way.  Make no mistake about it, Reinsdorf calls the shots - especially on the major decisions.  One thing I am sure about, and that is both Williams and Hahn are Reinsdorf's toadies.

    Reinsdorf wants an impact player to generate fan interest in order to make money by putting more fannies in the seats, increasing TV ratings/revenues, and selling sickeningly ugly multi-colored jersies.  It all about marketing, not winning.  A player like Jose Iglesias, who went to the Tigers in the Peavy deal, could easily be more instrumental in making the Sox a winning team than will Avisail Garcia thru timely hitting and playing a great defensive game at shortstop.  But Iglesias doesn't have any power; he's not the kind of player Reinsdorf wants.  Reinsdorf's infatuation with one-dimensional power hitters predates the reign of Kenny Williams as general manager.  I'm not saying that Reinsdorf directly said to take Garcia over Iglesias, but both Hahn and Williams before him know what the Chairman likes.

    I'm still impressed, though, that Rick Hahn was able to get as much as he did for Peavy without picking up a large chunk of his salary.  I don't believe that the dumb football jock Williams would have been able to pull off such a deal.  Hahn, being a savvy lawyer, patiently negotiated a very good trade.  That in itself holds promise for the future.  And when all is said and done, maybe Reinsdorf will have his impact player in Garcia.
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:41 am

    Reinsdorf wants an impact player to generate fan interest in order to make money by putting more fannies in the seats, increasing TV ratings/revenues, and selling sickeningly ugly multi-colored jersies.

    **************************************************************

    I don't really buy that MJ. If that were the case then Reinsdorf would be a consistently major player in the free agent market. He's not. In my opinion, his refusal to deal with Scott Boras makes a case for this. I think priority one for him is to get by on the cheap. What's sad is that on those rare ocassions when Jerry loosens the purse strings, he had an incompetent GM throwing around silly money for a bunch of stiffs.

    You may be right about Hahn being his own man but I just have a hard time believing Kenny Williams is content sitting around watching someone else in the organization doing his old job. Also, Avisail Garcia strikes me as exactly the type of player Williams would have a hard-on for.

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:39 am

    Cream1953 wrote:Reinsdorf wants an impact player to generate fan interest in order to make money by putting more fannies in the seats, increasing TV ratings/revenues, and selling sickeningly ugly multi-colored jersies.

    **************************************************************

    I don't really buy that MJ. If that were the case then Reinsdorf would be a consistently major player in the free agent market. He's not. In my opinion, his refusal to deal with Scott Boras makes a case for this. I think priority one for him is to get by on the cheap. What's sad is that on those rare ocassions when Jerry loosens the purse strings, he had an incompetent GM throwing around silly money for a bunch of stiffs.

    You may be right about Hahn being his own man but I just have a hard time believing Kenny Williams is content sitting around watching someone else in the organization doing his old job. Also, Avisail Garcia strikes me as exactly the type of player Williams would have a hard-on for.

    I should have said that Reinsdorf would prefer to try to get his impact player on the cheap. It goes back to the days of getting an old washed-up George Foster in the 1980's or a hip-replaced Bo Jackson in the 1990's. Reinsdorf also wants celebrities like Jackson and Michael Jordan and occasionally he will pay big money for them like with Albert Belle. It's comes down to how he perceives he can make the most profit thru marketing.

    I agree that Avisail Garcia is the type of player that KW would have gone after, as is the guy they picked up in the Thornton trade Brandon Jacobs. It comes down to who's calling the shots. Is it Reinsdorf or Williams or Hahn? You may very well be right in that Williams has undo influence over Hahn. I don't know. But I do know that Reinsdorf is naming the tune, and the other two guys are obediently dancing to it.
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    rmapasad
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by rmapasad on Thu Aug 01, 2013 1:49 pm

    MGJOHNSON wrote:
    Cream1953 wrote:I've said it time and again and I'll say it again....Williams has NOT quietly faded away. His mark is all over this team and the notion that he was just going to turn things over to Hahn and slip into the corner is ludicrous. Man seems to have waaaayyyy to much ego for that to happen. I think Hahn is little more than Kenny's toady.

    Well, if Hahn is KW's toady, and I'm not sure that he is, it's because Reinsdorf wants it that way.  Make no mistake about it, Reinsdorf calls the shots - especially on the major decisions.  One thing I am sure about, and that is both Williams and Hahn are Reinsdorf's toadies.

    Reinsdorf wants an impact player to generate fan interest in order to make money by putting more fannies in the seats, increasing TV ratings/revenues, and selling sickeningly ugly multi-colored jersies.  It all about marketing, not winning.  A player like Jose Iglesias, who went to the Tigers in the Peavy deal, could easily be more instrumental in making the Sox a winning team than will Avisail Garcia thru timely hitting and playing a great defensive game at shortstop.  But Iglesias doesn't have any power; he's not the kind of player Reinsdorf wants.  Reinsdorf's infatuation with one-dimensional power hitters predates the reign of Kenny Williams as general manager.  I'm not saying that Reinsdorf directly said to take Garcia over Iglesias, but both Hahn and Williams before him know what the Chairman likes.

    I'm still impressed, though, that Rick Hahn was able to get as much as he did for Peavy without picking up a large chunk of his salary.  I don't believe that the dumb football jock Williams would have been able to pull off such a deal.  Hahn, being a savvy lawyer, patiently negotiated a very good trade.  That in itself holds promise for the future.  And when all is said and done, maybe Reinsdorf will have his impact player in Garcia.


    Mart, you state the case very well. You're probably right in that Reinsdorf wants a more "impact" player or someone that at least looks like he could be that.  So when Kenny, the scouts and ultimately Hahn went to Reinsdorf with Garcia they probably knew how to sell him on "upside"., "potential", blah, blah. It obviously helped that they could tell Reiny that they were also dumping $ 23 million of Peavy's remaining salary and replacing that with guys at major league minimum wage Smile 
    All that said, I have to respectfully disagree about being impressed about what Hahn landed.  Yes, he did get a guy who was ranked 74th in BA's overall top prospects, has reached the majors at age 22, and was hitting .374 at AAA this year.  Yes, he is a classic "5 tool" player with good potential.  But, as with Viciedo, Jacobs, Mitchell, Thompson, etc. there's a common theme - raw athleticism that hasn't translated into good baseball skills.   

    Garcia's ability to recognize pitches is very questionable.  He strikes out 5 times more than he walks (minors and majors both), and nobody in recent major league history has had much of a career with that type track record.   According to Fangraphs, since late 70's, only about 50 guys who struck out more than 4 times than they walked  managed to get 1000 or more big league PA's and the names read like a who's who of nobodies  - Craig Paquette, Todd Greene, Willy Mo Pena, etc, - the guy with the longest career was Shawn Dunston. Unfortunately some very familiar names were on that list too - Miguel Olivo, Dewayne Wise,  Dayan Viciedo, and yes, Kenny Williams.
    Unfortunately, this list says that history is not on Garcia's side, and it also goes a long way toward explaining why the Sox chose him. 









     
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    Cream1953
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Thu Aug 01, 2013 2:49 pm

    Garcia's ability to recognize pitches is very questionable.  He strikes out 5 times more than he walks

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    Stick him between Oaf and the Cuban Pimp and let the good times roll!! cheers

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by MGJOHNSON on Thu Aug 01, 2013 3:03 pm

    Cream1953 wrote:Garcia's ability to recognize pitches is very questionable.  He strikes out 5 times more than he walks

    *************************************************************************

    Stick him between Oaf and the Cuban Pimp and let the good times roll!! cheers

    If they could somehow set up a compressor with some coolant at home plate and then let these guys swing away, maybe the Sox could cool the whole city. Cool
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:22 pm

    sox55 wrote:Like they said in Jersey Boys about what happened when Sherry was released:"THE WHOLE WORLD EXPLODED" will REPEAT when Bobby gets back from vacation and finds out that WIN NOW, version 2014, is Hahn's "plan".
    WRONG!!!!!  WRONG!!!!  WRONG!!!!

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by frank bonifacic on Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:49 pm

    Hawk Harrelson wrote:
    sox55 wrote:Like they said in Jersey Boys about what happened when Sherry was released:"THE WHOLE WORLD EXPLODED" will REPEAT when Bobby gets back from vacation and finds out that WIN NOW, version 2014, is Hahn's "plan".
    WRONG!!!!!  WRONG!!!!  WRONG!!!!

    DAMN. You remember slights more than an aggrieved WIFE!!!

    Read about six posts before I realized they were over a year old-and sadly, seemed like they could have been written this week.
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Tue Jul 22, 2014 2:06 pm

    DAMN. You remember slights more than an aggrieved WIFE!!!

    ***********************************************************************

    No shit. Does he actually go back and re-read this stuff? Christ, I'm not even interested in what I wrote a year ago let alone anyone else.

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by frank bonifacic on Tue Jul 22, 2014 2:09 pm

    Cream1953 wrote:DAMN. You remember slights more than an aggrieved WIFE!!!

    ***********************************************************************

    No shit. Does he actually go back and re-read this stuff? Christ, I'm not even interested in what I wrote a year ago let alone anyone else.

    Hell, I'm not even interested in what YOU wrote yesterday!!
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Tue Jul 22, 2014 2:31 pm

    tongue

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Guest on Tue Jul 22, 2014 6:29 pm

    Cream1953 wrote:DAMN. You remember slights more than an aggrieved WIFE!!!

    ***********************************************************************

    No shit. Does he actually go back and re-read this stuff? Christ, I'm not even interested in what I wrote a year ago let alone anyone else


    WHO YOU CRAPPING

    YOU LIVE FOR THE KARK'S POLITICAL POETRY IN BLAGO'S CELL


    AND JUST WAIT UNTIL THE KARK FINDS THE TIME TO GO BACK TO 2010 WHERE I HAD A CERTAIN SOMEBODY SCREAMING MULTICOLINEARITY LIKE A LITTLE GIRL

    HOWEVER, I SUSPECT THAT MAY HAVE BEEN ON THE AOL SITE.  SO JOHN DANK'S #1 FAN MIGHT BE SPARED FURTHER EMBARASSMENT
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Tue Jul 22, 2014 6:55 pm

    frank bonifacic wrote:
    Hawk Harrelson wrote:
    sox55 wrote:Like they said in Jersey Boys about what happened when Sherry was released:"THE WHOLE WORLD EXPLODED" will REPEAT when Bobby gets back from vacation and finds out that WIN NOW, version 2014, is Hahn's "plan".
    WRONG!!!!!  WRONG!!!!  WRONG!!!!

    DAMN. You remember slights more than an aggrieved WIFE!!!

    Read about six posts before I realized they were over a year old-and sadly, seemed like they could have been written this week.
    How about it!!!  Every year seems to be the same old song!!!

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by frank bonifacic on Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:38 pm

    Hawk Harrelson wrote:
    frank bonifacic wrote:
    Hawk Harrelson wrote:
    sox55 wrote:Like they said in Jersey Boys about what happened when Sherry was released:"THE WHOLE WORLD EXPLODED" will REPEAT when Bobby gets back from vacation and finds out that WIN NOW, version 2014, is Hahn's "plan".
    WRONG!!!!!  WRONG!!!!  WRONG!!!!

    DAMN. You remember slights more than an aggrieved WIFE!!!

    Read about six posts before I realized they were over a year old-and sadly, seemed like they could have been written this week.
    How about it!!!  Every year seems to be the same old song!!!


    YOU OR HIM??? -- OR BOTH
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Hawk Harrelson on Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:02 pm

    The Sox suck every year.  Both would be correct.


    WIN NOW was an absolute farce since 2008.  A joke.

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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Guest on Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:19 pm

    Hahn and the Sox need a closer ...Sergio Santos was just released by the Jays ....as I recall, there was quite a bit of angst when the Sox traded him for the A-ball power arm floppo
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    Re: Rick Hahn's "Plan"

    Post by Cream1953 on Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:33 pm

    Kark was devastated when Santos was dealt. I enjoyed every moment of it.  Very Happy 

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